Should Toronto be its own province? Q&A

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there is another suggestion on the table and that is the session just after Doug Ford made his proposal and outspoken former Toronto city planner Andrew the race from their Jennifer qismat tweeted this on Thursday saying secession okay she followed up saying now I’ve had a chance to sleep on it secession why should have city of 2.8 million not have self-governance the province of Toronto does it have a ring to it or is it crazy talk the fact is this isn’t the first time the ideas been floated politicians and urban Affairs commentators have proposed this idea several times in the last decade in 2010 conservative NPP Bill Murdock suggested making Toronto Canada’s 11th Province his argument was that rural areas of Ontario have little quote in the legislative assembly of Ontario compared to Toronto then Toronto mayor David Miller indicated he would consider a pub debate about the possible secession these debates faded but is this an idea whose time has come or at least come back let’s ask our pan Canadian panel tonight cuz everyone has an opinion about Toronto in Toronto and Brittany and research manager at the Broadband Institute Charles Adler host of Charles Adler tonight joining us from Vancouver and from Edmonton tonight Zane belge vice president strategy and Communications firm North weather joining us now okay let me start with you what do you think is it is it an interesting idea to the province into it is obviously unrealistic opening up the Constitution is no small feat that is not an easily attainable option but what position does do it to have a conversation around what who and what Toronto is in the butter context of Canadians acai so I mentioned before it is a city of a population of 2.8 million its extremely diverse the one of the most diverse cities in the world is our first stop shop for newcomers it is whether we like it or not the economic engine country to give him his very distinct nature the very distinct nature of Toronto we should really consider think about how do we ensure that it seems like City like this can effectively govern how do we ensure that a city like this has a Powers 2 more independently considering that it is a city with such a broad and unique characteristics to do what it needs to be done in order to have strong local representation city council to do their jobs okay I want a reminder Audience by the way that we are streaming live on Facebook right now also we’re up on YouTube if you have questions with them on Twitter post to us on Facebook I’ll take them to our panel and you can get involved in the discussion as well alright they let me ask you is this an unrealistic notion in your opinion I mean Toronto isn’t a province already I mean I I think you could ask half of torontonians I think they think they’re their own country or IM just written 30 minutes of Toronto jokes just trying out my set material which I’ll share for another time I don’t think it’s realistic but I think there’s two big things that that that welcome this conversation number one and let me just remove it away from Toronto for half a second 22 what role do municipalities especially larger municipalities play as relation to their Province you know and I talk here from from Calgary talking about municipal election we just had about a year to date and one of the big topics was you know Municipal taxation Edmonton and Calgary bring the largest cities in Alberta but having such limited taxation Powers so as to not provide for their own infrastructure into not remedy the problems that they have within their own City that I think that’s part of this conversation introduce is is about the politics and in the campaign strategy or for half a second ninjas peeling back as to why you don’t just keep that has done this no she’s a candidate running for mayor that has very little name recognition and she’s getting us at about an issue while simultaneously trying to grow a coalition Beyond maybe a progressive Wing that she might directly speak to so when we talk about the politics of it she comes out of it on the other side of it looking like a champion for civic pride a champion fur for Toronto in the so this argument against Doug Ford at the end of the day it’s implausible in and legislation around it I think it’s just totally impractical but it gets us having this conversation on what do municipalities within our confederation need to be more powerful in this Urban world by that we’re seeing scale even more to the urban side of the equation from let’s see start with that great campaign platform to Luzon VM D’Souza on Twitter says that’s a wacko notion Susan Burgess would be Toronto or the GTA a lot of people work in Toronto live in the suburbs on YouTube they should become their own Province on the condition they get 0 transfer payments from other provinces and no federal handouts when they inevitably go broke Charles what do you think about to park and Newstalk in summer the dog days of summer this summer in Alberta and Ontario want to only talk about the big picture big picture is not as much fun as the little picture the little picture isn’t there is an Impulse in Toronto because Doug Ford one impulse to separate I have a feeling that happens a lot in this country we may we may want to give it the big picture brought her contact when I grew up in Pierre Trudeau’s Montreal and Rene Levesque Montreal and all of us in the West End which is where I live which is predominantly English speaking island which was predominantly Westin Montreal and West Island and Western what causes an Impulse this is an actual thing to consider in the wake of Doug for trying to slash and dismantle the fundamental workings of Toronto City Council like this requires us to actually have a conversation around how do we answer the Hagerty of Toronto City Council and local governments tax what we have a premier who’s ready to dismantle it immediately in the middle of municipal election like that is wild in itself so I do could be more effective immediately immediately run in and and set his own agenda when does Britney has Toronto the good citizens of Montreal and the good citizens of Toronto this gates at building at sort of a wall to keep the barbarians out and Ford Nation represents the Barbarian this conversation this conversation let’s not forget the federal government does have the power to work directly with municipalities so it’s not completely unattainable for the city of Toronto to kind of bypass where to get things done so this might not be a good route for Premier for it to go down because if he does not have I would say the best interest of torontonians at heart there were there other options on the table wrong with having a side it wouldn’t be binding but you could put up leather side on the next municipal election in Toronto are their own special region separate from the province’s that contain them it makes sense to me is the cities populations are often greater than those of their provinces and have extremely different needs and interest Melanie green him on the same on the same comment you should be on the same idea it should be its own District like DC maybe realize okay they’re not the center of the universe for once I’m not sure what has to do with the other but there you have it so what about that idea Zane why don’t you weigh in it’s really nice to try to go after we talk about depression here in Alberta like every 3 weeks I’m just like whatever the program before if we’re getting serious about this notion one of the things that I think is quite dangerous from a political point of view I’m frankly from a governance and an in Confederacy point of view is that conversations like this start demonstrating more of the difference rather than trying to bridge more of the commonality and I’m not criticizing out of trying to do that I understand but the danger here is in a world where we have increasingly more urban World divided increasing more sort of pointedness two words what that divide is specifically run topic said that that individuals and Rural communities make care about it vs. urban communities in urban centers conversations like this I think have a very dangerous slippery slope around what the could mean heading into you know commonality of vision and purpose and governance which is actually what’s at the heart of this for both municipalities and provinces at-large and I think it’s it’s a really dangerous point of view not just potentially crazy but a dangerous point of view policy Confederacy level and I think that’s that’s quite an important conversation to have when we introduce ideas like this how do you how do you say to the city of Toronto which is quite unique as you’ve all pointed out and Brittany in particular how do you say well how do you get your interest more looked after in grand scheme of things maybe the answer won’t be by being Canada’s most important city which is it which it is today and going down to being Canada’s most average Province cuz that’s what would happen you would have a city of 2.8 million where is the most powerful City but then would end up being the most average for the province when it if it were to secede going forward this was a real plausible or actual serious scenario that’s he’s not with putting forward more independently maybe it’s the fundamental flaw of our Constitution that is that it that needs to be questioned here right as city of 2.8 million is still a creature of this province maybe that’s what’s dangerous Vancouver same with these major municipalities that portion of the conversation was fascinating and important is not isolated the Toronto but it’s isolated to the municipalities across the across this country and go to do taxation durability do social programs in their ability to hyper focus on what is uniquely important to them about how do you balance that with an increasing Urban World divided that is even more tenuous has been in in our recent past who are open to the idea have over the years agreed it’s not good for you don’t feel Toronto has been getting too much so they wanted a separation for that ring reason Toronto feeling that is not getting the attention or the Avea the money or the power that it deserves therefore can’t proceed with some of these big ideas that it wants to do transportation for example so that’s both thought there have been people on both sides who have looked to be changed where they go the session or not and they agree on the reasons why Suburban I mean wanted to look forward to being there people in Mississauga wanted Doug Ford I have to be there so I just think about this one tooth and a lot of shells I don’t think I was led to the fall of several Progressive Party because of their inability to stand with you call it Suburban I call it rule whatever that may be that Coalition that cocktail of Voters whatever their needs are is uniquely different I think that’s at the heart of this conversation Progressive parties don’t take the suburb seriously why is it the big progressive tense I think there was a lot of room for the nvpm and you saw his later on in the election as well but to have expanded more into the Suburban regions of Toronto and itself but also Within Britney and Romo policy and research manager the Broadband Institute Charles Adler host of Charles Adler tonight insane belge vice-president North weather thank you for joining us and thank you at home everybody on your cell phones or on your computer hours for joining us tonight as well
Should Toronto be its own province? Jennifer Keesmaat, a former Toronto city planner, is running for mayor and has suggested the city should secede from Ontario and become Canada’s 11th province. Our panel casts its own opinions and are taking your questions. Ask them in the chat. To read more: https://www.cbc.ca/1.4765726

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